More (alleged) accusations of "Power Struggles" within the SRCM (tm)
This comment was left on Michael's Blog, Inner Circle of SRCM, http://innercircleofsrcm.blogspot.com/
in the Comments of the first section by a "Ravi" who is an abhyasi...
http://www.blogger.com/comment.g?blogID=27865974&postID=115201205019302326
Hi Everyone associated with SRCM
Pranams,
What is your opinion on illegal capture of Ashram at Shahjahanpur by Chari group during March - April 2006. Being an Abhyasi I sincerely condemn it.
I am an Abhyasi from a group who do not believe in The Living Master or simply do not consider Chari as Master. As there was no such concept when Babuji was there. Rather, he stressed on strong living media, i.e. a strong preceptor with strong will power.
For us only Babuji Maharaj is eternal master. Divine Master in the real sense never dies nor he requires physical body, hence, no question of living master.
The Chari group people illegally captured the Ashram. They forcefully quit the people in the Ashram who are not associate with Chari. There were such capturing occasions earlier also in some other places like Vijayawada, Raichoor etc. Where is spirituality in that group? What for they are doing such things. Do they think being very rich group any thing can be done? I have seen people are getting attracted to the Buildings / Posh Ashrams etc.
What is your opinion on this?
Once againPranam
Ravi
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16 comments:
Better do not involve in unnecessary postings,
I hope you people must be having some better job to do as you neither earn value for your comments nor you would be happy after such comments, may be your ego will be satisfied for cursing a person like this, to boost up your ego please try something else which would at least satisfy your hunger.
If at all Chariji did anything, he did everything thing in His Master’s Footsteps.
He never wanted to be called as a Master;
It is the Abhyasis who accepted him as Master all over the world.
He never wanted any power or money; if he wanted money he could have earned billions as a director of a company.
If he wanted Power or fame then he could have earned it as a musician.
But he has left everything for the good of humanity and he took up a path where his master Babuji demanded him to get in.
He has elected Sahaj Marg his’s life because he loved his’s master to that extent where in he could just follow what his’s master wanted him to do.
Please do not give much attention in criticism of such a noble personality, who is working for the sake of humanity. If at all if the property or anything belongs to his’s master which is under dispute he will attend that. He is duty bounded and he is working for a higher cause which is beyond our scope.
Therefore All the comments which were made are now voided. Amen!
Raja
Hello Don it's que. I have slight dyslexia though it has never hammpered me too much. I do sometimes find it hard. I will remain an internet surfer of all the work you and your friends do and contribute when I feel neccessary, The feelings this group bring to us all are very frustating. She wolf brought a tear to my eye and I hope her struggle has amounted to something. Stay firm and resolute, merry christmas.
dear brother,
let me know whether chariji is real master or fake ?
because several abyasis told me that mr.chari is having illicit relation-ship with ladies.
kindly respond me immediately,
abyasi
HI Abhyasi..
I can't tell you that because ALL is your Master as ALL teaches you lessons and You are Master as you teach lessons to ALL...
I can say that Chari does not consider himself a Master of SPIRITUALITY but he considers himself a Master of HUMANITY. Those are his claims in one of his books. So in other words, he can "manipulate" or "lead" people but not necessarily to "a better view of Reality".
For myself, having been disappointed by many on this rugged road of LIFE, I chose to go directly to ONE without a Proxy or a "go-between". That way, I am an adult and responsible for my own actions and my own salvation or liberation...
These "religious" games are all for the structures anyway...The ONE has saved and liberated us all from our birth...this life is a GIFT, not something we earned...It is up to us to make the best of this TIME and SPACE on this little planet and not waste our time "navel-gazing" and reaching an "imaginary goal" that are made up by Megalomaniacs and con-men of religions
Sahaj Marg is not SPIRITUALITY but "SPIRITUALISM"...
Read all the other experiences and testimonials of the "INNER" people and judge for yourself...
I WILL NOT BE FOOLED AGAIN by these businessmen who appoint themselves "masters" and re-register small meditation groups in another country such as Chari did with the help of his henchman, Santosh, from Austin Texas...
4d-don
don
we want your brief spiritual journey
till now from your birth.
pl.enlighten us.
best regards.
Mr.Don
I have asked you about a sitting( inabsentia), As you are a preceptor and closely associated with master( Sri Ramchandraji Maharaj). Kindly,accept my request and tell me your convenient time for giving me a sitting.
with best regards.
Rajan
Hi Rajan...
You must have me confused with Michael who was a preceptor and a close associate of Chari, having been name a preceptor by him and having been a member of his "inner circle".
I told you, and all readers, that Babuji was not "MY" Master but a fellow pilgrim on Life's rugged by beautiful road, a friend, just like you. I don't do the work of "mystifying" my fellow pilgrims, nor raising them on pedestals or altars, but I try to sent "friends and family" directly to the ONE without a "proxy" or a "go-between"...that is what I do for my sons, grand-children, and friends...and it is what I will do for you.
The NEW covennant between you and the ONE is now in your ALL (body, mind, soul). Touch it there, not in another person... In another person, you will eventually see "corruption" which is the MATTER that ALL is made of...
ALL is the CREATION... ONE is the CREATOR. GO TO ONE...since you are already in the ALL...just like "all of us".
If you want a preceptor of Babuji's, I can't help you as I am a believer in "Spiritual Sovereignty"... Babuji allowed for that...Chari does not...Hence I was a friend to Babuji...Chari considers me, and all like me, an "enemy of (his kind of) Spirituality". I consider Chari's spirituality, to be really "spiritualism" or Vaishnavism (the little I know of it) ... so I will just try and point seeking SOULS to the ONE...not to the SPIRITS of the DECEASED...
4d-don...
My history as a SPIRIT...Part of which is the entity called DON.
I AM. I WAS. I WILL BE.
In your time, as two Canadian earthling lovers were copulating, mixing their male seed with the female egg, I AM.
Part of "I AM", inhabits the entity called DON... but I am "too large for VULGAR SPACE". Much of "I AM" is outside of your TIME and SPACE. Any further HISTORY would just CONFUSE the reader.
FIND THE ONE inside yourself, and your will understand. Words are too "limiting" for EXPERIENCE to SHINE. The WISE do not PREACH.
"I AM" IS EVERYTHING, EVERYWHERE, EVERYWHEN, You are inside SPIRIT also...Just open the ALL (MIND, SOUL, BODY).
In your time, I AM..
This is DON...
That is all the SPIRIT has to say... The rest is my story...And that is not relevant to your LIFE...You have a STORY that leads you to ONE...don't take my or anyone else's journey or you will lose yourself and not reach your GOAL but the GOAL of the ones you follow.
May you realize the ONE inside your SELF...
4d-Don...
Mr.Don,
Your explanation about yourself is very interesting. I have three questions which i think your kindself will answer.
1)A spiritual guru( like babuji maharaj) is essential for reaching one's own ultimate ?
2) With out any mediator or guru one can reach one's ultimate ?
In the above Which is according to you is correct?
3) Do you believe in re-birth or previous births ?
Kindly give your opinion.
regards.
Rajan
Rajan...
When you were a child, you needed your parents to care for you. When you became an adult, you relied on yourself, friends and family, and a few "experts" to help you decide on issues you knew little about. Still you decided for yourself and the for "young ones" and others in your family.
Gurus, priests, Masters (in all fields...not only RELIGION) are to "HELP"...not to rely on and certainly not to "OBEY" as a child is "FORCED" to obey his parents for the sake of his/her safety...
When your child reaches adulthood (16 yrs in some countries), the parents are wise to let the child make his/her own mistakes, for the sake of his/her confidence, growth and general health. He/she will, after all, have 'children" and he/she must be prepared and ready to be an "ADULT"...
If there is such a Law as the LAW of ACTION and REACTION, what some call "KARMA", then you as a "SOVEREIGN SPIRIT" have to be able to make your own decisions so as to GROW in the MIND and the BODY...the SPIRIT does not GROW...IT IS ONE
Be an adult and take on your own responsibilities for your spirituality as you would for your mental and material health, much as you would ask others to do. How else will we stop the "religious" abusers that have led mankind to war for millenia if we keep building their power over us.
DO not a servant nor a Master be...
The new covenant between you and the ONE is written on your ALL (Mind, Body, SPIRIT). LOOK THERE! If some say: HE's on the MOUNTAIN...Don't go. IF they say: HE's Ram Chandra! Don't Believe them. (notice I use "HE" because those who put a place and a direction on the ONE, also give IT an attribute of "MALE-ness". What about our daughters? Do we not demand that the ONE be ALL genders and more, at least?
The ONE, since it created a dynamic UNIVERSE of MOTION in ALL directions (scalar), should be at least, multi-dimensional,(n...d) and BE everything, everywhere, everywhen (the E-Trinity), outside of the illusion of TIME. Babuji existed in TIME and is now SPIRIT and OUTSIDE of time. Do not, as an adult, chase the spirits of the deceased for temporal knowledge or guidance. Use their lives and words as "guideposts"...not as ritual, dogma, or tenet. It does not apply. Become a charitable, compassionate, loving person and find SPIRIT within.
2. And beyond. As we stand on the shoulders of GIANTS, we will see further that they. Our children will not be "illumined" by our knowledge of a "pre-information" age, and we would be wise to not "hold them back" to our little arrogant conception of "KNOWLEDGE"... When we were young, the planet still had un-tapped resources. Our children now have to manage the limited and dwindling planetary resources because of our, and other previous generation's lack of foresight and wisdom, which religion was supposed to give us.
It did not. It kept us divided and at war with one another, or "entertained" with rituals.
They (our children) will have to take care of HUMANS, not Religious STRUCTURES that are monuments to our collective "stupidity" and/or servants to our addiction to man-made POWER. We, who do not dare to "represent" the ONE, or even FIND the ONE, follow others who are ruthless, arrogant and "megalomaniacal" to the point of giving themselves titles of "DIVINITY" (Special Personality, God, etc..). I chuckle in love at their "silliness", and tell others that they are "good people", but a little "egotistical". Smokers (as Babuji) can justify their addictions but can only teach how to "quit" smoking to those more silly than the SMOKER.
Yes, we will reach the ULTIMATE some day, if you want to be IN TIME... If there is an ULTIMATE, (there ain't NONE), then IT IS HERE NOW... For the ONE to REACH ULTIMATE stage in the FUTURE, IT would mean that the ONE would STOP the MOTION that is the UNIVERSE. If ONE stops, there is no UNIVERSE, as it is a UNIVERSE OF MOTION, and we are IN IT NOW). To give yourself an imaginary goal (in time) and then to never reach it, is RELIGION's and con-men's addiction modus operandi. Computer games and gambling, are like that. The player will never really WIN...
SPIRIT is outside of TIME. So there is no goal that the SPIRIT or the ONE has not reached NOW and FOREVER.
BE HERE NOW!
3. I believe in evolution in the material plane. I believe that re-incarnation is not needed for SPIRIT and the ONE. If there is "re-incarnation" of the body, it is not the "flesh and blood", nor the whole of a "personality" the re-incarnates, but it could operate in the little access to MIND and information (intellectual and emotional), that all have. If we are re-born, then it is in the parts of our being that we gave "ENERGY" to that WE are reborn, and not the whole coherent person-ality. Talents for instance are one example of a phenomenon, where some believers use "re-incarnation" to explain.
Because MOzart could write symphonies at 7 years old, they claim that it could mean that the musical "information" could have stayed "co-herent" in more than one "entity" across TIME. Writing is such a coherent mechanism. But the rest of that past "entity's" personality, was not necessarily tied to the musical talent that Mozart's received, and that he was prepared to receive by practice and the love of practice. The rest of Mozart's personality was not developed as were his musical skills. So re-incarnation could mean that some part of the "information" that we place "energy" into, could remain as a coherent whole to some degree, but the whole "soul" (another invention of religions), I prefer MIND, does not usually cross TIME as a coherent "person-ality" to a great degree and remain coherent.
I don't know of any who have been tested and studied to PROVE that. Until then, it is just another religious theory, and to be taken like all "faith-base" theories, with a grain of salt. That could be why ONE gave us temporal and physical "death", so as to clean the Universal slate and leave the "blackboard" of life blank for the next generation of US. Life seems to prefer intellect on this planet, as an "intellectual" species, Homo Sapiens, became, through evolution (or "re-incarnation"?), the DOMINANT on this planet. In our Spirituality, let us be grateful and use our "SAPIENS" so as to fulfill our DESTINY of the continuation of LIFE. And that means, to shoulder one's responsibilities, even our SPIRITUAL responsibilities and have faith in the ETERNAL ONE...not in corruptible MATTER, such are HUMANS, and MIND operates in TIME.
We may evolve "collectively" more than "individually". There are some collective traits that in some societies, have become cultural such as beliefs, myths, lores, legends, arts, crafts, skills, etc... that are not really SPIRITUALITY but are facets of the MIND (collective sub-conscious) that seem to be cumulative and get carried by future generations. I don't believe in "cross-migration" of whole "SOULS" or personalities, from humans to animals except by the amount of energy one places on specific aspects of one's life (emotions, intellect, spiritual). A glutton could be reborn with the traits of a glutton-ous animal, but not as that specific animal.
So, do I believe in "re-incarnation"? Not as a way to blame my actions and talents on previous "incarnations" of myself. But I gather from wherever I sense so in a sense, I am accumulation of Past lives, and past generations but not necessarily my own or DON. I may have a bit of talent in one field from one past evolutionary stage or "incarnation" and a bit of talent from another past evolutionary stage, or incarnation, and/or a serious flaw from a tendency, a mutation, a disease, etc.. in my body to help me or my species learn new lessons, adapt and experience ALL of LIFE.
We are ONE, WE are SPIRIT, then, in time, we are LIFE...Then, in time, we are HOMO SAPIENS, then we are MATTER. That is "INCARNATION"...and if one become conscious of SPIRIT, one INCARNATES as one WILLs. I am the WIND... I am a thought... I am LIGHT...I AM SOUND... and I did not have to RE-incarnate to BE... I AM THAT I AM... I work with ATMAN ... but I AM.
Re-incarnation is for those who remain trapped before SPIRIT consciousness.
4d-don
Mr.Don,
I could not understand your thealogy completely. I hope, you are talking about the concept of ' Aham Bhramhasmi'.That is 'I am the Spirit or soul-eternal. which is Beyond time(finite /The first movement)Space( matter and energy) and Causation(Illusion/Maya/nature) and I am ONE with out a second or third.
The above may be what you have tried to explain me logically, reaonably about the condition of reality which is beyond mind.But i do not understand how a born- blind can understand the nature of light unless his eyes are opend by a doctor.
But i want to ask your goodselves some quieries :
1) Meat eating is not benifitial for spiritual upliftment.
2) Alchohal or liquir is not benifitial for spiritual progress.
3) Sex is for procreation and not for recreation( adultory).Spirituality with out morality is of no use.
Kindly clarify the above.
Best wishes.
Rajan
Rajan...
I am not familiar with the terms in your culture and language, but if they are the same as the "physics" terms that you describe, then OK...but you could research that in your "theology". I see some small corrections.
In my theology, that begins with the historic Greek concept of LOGOS (Logic as defined by Sound, using WORDS) the concept of "first movement" or "creation", and "eternal" which means: "no beginning, and no end", hence "no creation", are contradictory. "First movement" is compatible with "infinity" which has a beginning but no end.
These intellectual concepts of "infinity" are of TIME, while concepts of "eternity or eternal" are of SPACE... hence a Multi-dimensional BEING as opposed to "DOING" or...rather than "becoming" or the "FIRST movement" as you call it. The concept of "FIRST" is a TIME concept and indicates a 1d line. It is not in the REALITY of SPACE. Even LIGHT, will bend and does not remain "linear". We now know that SPACE is 3d and more, (n...d) and is SCALAR (in all directions at the same TIME) ...
... Once a circle is made for instance (as a limited example), the beginning of the circle is the END of the CIRCLE. Or we can say: the circle has no beginning and no end. One can say that the circle is "eternal" unless one wants to talk about "who made the circle" and then we can say that it is "infinite" as it has a CREATOR. I prefer the analogy of the SPIRAL but... the circle is 2d and easily understood.
In the case of the UNIVERSE...the CREATOR IS the CREATION (eternal). For those who need a "creator" or a beginning (the "faith-based" adherents), IT "BECOMES" the UNIVERSE (infinity), by Changing (over TIME which is defined as: "the measurement of MOTION or CHANGE) the frequency (or speed) of ITS MOTION, not of the MATTER of the UNIVERSE itself as it does not EXIST yet, in this analogy. (in TIME).
Matter is created (or more accurately, is seen to exist) by or as a by-product of the MOTION of SPACE itself. Our first material encounter (after the ethereal "sea of quarks", and the "Plasmas" (ionized gases) with MATTER, hydrogen, the primordial gas, is represented by one unit of POSITIVE energy, surrounded by one unit of NEGATIVE energy in MOTION, a motion so fast that it gives one a feeling of "materiality", or solid, but it is all ENERGY and/or MOTION. A force can be defined as "MOTION".
I like your: "I am ONE without a SECOND or a THIRD"... That is a concept of ETERNITY...if there is a second or third, then if becomes "infinity"...and has a "first movement" or a beginning.
You then go on to presume that we are "BORN BLIND"...we are not... If you are born blind, find a doctor, for the love of SIGHT, but once you have sight, the doctor will not SEE for you. You will not follow him around and "obey" him for infinity. You pay him, thank him and then, move on with your life. In the case of Mankind needing a "master", we did at one time but now, most don't... MOST of us are now born with SIGHT and are "seers" (prophets)... We don't only see in 1d (time), or 2d, or 3d but in 4d, and beyond in n...d. Some are in the "transition" stage of seeing in 4d and beyond and think that they need a 'doctor" to make them see, but one just has to OPEN THE EYES... If in your "ASHRAM" you complain of not seeing the SUN, then GO OUTSIDE and see the REALITY. Inside is a MAN-made UNIVERSE...not NATURE. If you want the NATURAL path, GO OUTSIDE in NATURE.
Eat meat if you must... You must begin your Spiritual journey where you are, not where your RELIGION tells you to BE. Eskimos are spiritual also, and some more so than some "WHITES" or BROWNS, or REDS or BLACKS ... They eat MEAT...
Drink alcohol if you desire it or for "health" reasons, or to have FUN... but in moderation and with responsibility.
Have sex for fun if you desire, but keep in mind that you are spending time on a "pleasure", just like "scratching an itch", singing a song, etc... Sensual pleasures can be addictive, but so can "religious dogmatism" and "rituals". The "feel good" of belonging to a group induces "alpha waves" and makes on feel "good" and is addictive also, just like the sexual organs. The MIND will look for PLEASURE ... CONTROL all your senses...do not demonize them. The bee, to be Natural, does not demonize the sweet scent of the flower's nectar, making it a sin to "indulge" in the sweet aroma.
These are all "man-made" rules and make sense if "moderated" with the MIND or LOGIC (LOGOS)... All of LIFE is for us to Experience in moderation...not to shun as if the ONE had played (in time) a real cruel trick on us and placed us in a intoxicating UNIVERSE and gave orders to: DO NOT IMBIBE or you will go to HELL... That is RELIGION and their control Mechanisms...it is not the NATURAL PATH or the ONE ...
May you find your path and may it give you PLEASURE, not narcissism, where the pain of others become secondary to your "position" on the Path of your chosen MASTER. If you are on your way to meditation, and you see a "starving child", stop and feed him, do not continue and go meditate and think that you are being "SPIRITUAL"... Spirituality should polish the Intellect, and add compassion and charity to our emotions, along with their "god given" pleasure-able sensual rewards. Narcissism is also a "pleasure", and is "self-serving" or serves the EGO. Spirituality should open the eyes to the "suffering of OTHERS, not just to the pleasure of the SELF or the EGO.
One sometimes gets the feeling that the "navel-gazing" meditators are "Diddling (masturbating) while ROME burns"... This NATURAL planet, your home, your MOTHER, needs all of you "DO GOODERS", to do GOOD for ALL, not just "serve your self" or your GROUP (the MISSION)
4d-don
Don
I felt extreamly happy for your way of answering my questions. It shows that you must have conquered your senses either by your self efforts or due to the grace of Babuji Maharaj.
'When spirituality ends then Reality starts' what Babuji says. I do not know whether you have completed your journey or not. But certainly i can say that the Divinity owned you.
May your friend-ship with Master(Babuji Maharaj)live long and cherish.
With warm Regards.
Your Beloved friend,
Rajan.
Hi Rajan...
Thank you for you kind words... I am happy that my answers pleased you.
I must say, that in my Mind (memory) are Babuji and also, Jesus, the Christ of the Christians, (the True Jesus that I met on the "inside", and not necessarily the same Jesus as in the Christian Bible), Vivekananda, Buddha, Grey Eagle, and many other Saints or Wise men, as well as many "holy" women. I attribute my blessings to them all...
And I assure you that there is no "conquering" of the tools we call the "senses" completely until they and I are no more of this Physical life, so I will remain vigilant, specially around pride and ego, which includes the SPIRITUAL ego one can develop around the spiritual gifts that are so intoxicating. ONE-ness makes one want to Proselytize as if one could impart to others what is not ours.
The DIVINITY is ONE and hence owns ALL and Everything, including little 4d-don...and Rajan, wether he follows Babuji, Chari, or his own self-taught path to his own destiny.
Bless you on your journey...
4d-don
Master has said in one of the speeches that people who hate him will merge with him sooner because of the constant remembrance. So keep doing what you are doing brother.
One small request though, please dont impose your ideas on new or doubtful abhyasis. Let them try Sahaj Marg and decide for themselves.
I was a skeptic too and had many doubts when I joined. Now when I look back I am really happy for the changes in me. I respect other people more than my ego.
Love,
Anonymous
Hi Anonymous...
That must mean then, that Chari will also merge with "us" (for whom he shows his hate by falsely calling us the "enemies of spirituality") ... we are really (in REALITY) the enemies of "SPIRITUALISM" ... and you "cultists" show not your SPIRITUAL ONE-ness but your divided "SPIRITISM" ... learn to recognize the difference ...
Because you belong to a group (a "gang"?), you are divided from the other groups or "gangs" ... You can't be ONE with ALL ... I can ... I AM!
We, the truly SPIRITUAL humans will all continue merging with the ONE-ness that is ONE SPIRIT and that includes Babuji ... and Chari and you (the parts).
ALL is ONE ... some will realize that NOW, and some will have to wait to realize that LATER, but we will all realized our ONE-ness at ONE time or at another ONE time ...
You are not my "Brother", my brother is alive and is not a "living dead", as you abhyasis claim to be. You are part of the same "species" as I am, but you may be from another clan or from another "race" or from another family ... if you are not from my "blood" family, you are not my "brother"
The dead are not "anything" (except unconcious elemental or carbon matter ... or dust) ... and those who try and be dead while alive, they are "DEAD" in their mind, even while alive!! I will relate to that "living dead" person's MASTER ... If the Master is still alive ...
In the case of Babuji, he is also dead ... I will then relate to the ONE-ness which is still alive ... and not to the "dead parts" of life ...
You, of the "living dead", can't request anything of me, I will do what I want to do with and for the living, and then, when I've done that, I will do something else of my choosing ... I am FREE
I leave everyone else FREE also ...even those who believe in fantasies, "spirits" (ghosts?), and Mediums and messages from "the living dead" which allegedly live beyond the grave... and other such invented tribal fantasies.
Go in peace I am not a skeptic, I don't believe in your "heaven" and your "central region" or in your "spirits" (entities) ...
Live in REALITY if you want to be SPIRITUAL... get off you knees (or your behind) and do some good in the world ... for everyone, not just for the wealthy and/or your clan... or your race... or your group and family !!
Don...
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